Naam Japna

randip singh · #21 (**permalink**) 10-12-2007, 11:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aad0002

Now I admit to being clueless. Upon following the link provided by Sikh80 I discovered the teachings are those of Sree Swami Satyanand Ji Maharaj

Further investigation revealed the following information from the first google hit.
Shree Swami Satyanand Ji Maharaj, the founder of Shree Ram Sharnam, was born in 1861 in Rawalpindi. He had lost his parents in his early childhood. At the young age of 17, he took up the company of spiritual teachers of Jain faith. In 1891, at the age of 30, he joined the Arya Samaj, and studied Vedanta, Upanishads, and other sacred epics.

Later in the same article I found this

Swami Ji initiated Sadhna Satsangs for serious devotees to practice detachment, devotion, purity of body and mind, and healthy living habits. The first Sadhna Satsang was held in Haridwar, followed by many camps all over India. On November 13, 1960 while chanting "Ram Naam", Swamiji gave up his physical body after transferring his Spiritual Powers to his dear disciple Shree Prem Ji Maharaj, and designating him as the one to replace him. Shree Swamiji’s body was immersed in the Holy Ganges at Neel-Dhara near Haridwar, which has since become a unique Holy Place for all Amritvani devotees.

It is clear that the post is speaking of Nam Jap in a Vedantic tradition that is not Sikh -- and this needs to be made clear. It matters because the Swami in question upon his death installed a successor. So we are looking at a case of Guru in Human Form.

Seeker80, or anyone, what distinction need we draw between the message posted and Gurmat? Between the guruship of a human being, and the shabd of Sri Guru Granth Sahib?

The following link raises questions in a straightforward way.

Guru Rating Service

Interesting.

randip singh · #22 (**permalink**) 10-12-2007, 11:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sikh80

Our SGGS ji contains the Bani of many Saints who were not sikhs like Nam dev, Kabir sahib and even Muslims like Sheikh Farid. If the sikhs highest scripture includes the philosphical banis of these saintly personalities it stands to reason that one can read and follow that is as per sikhi.

.

Hmmm.

Please clarify....are you saying if I followed the Bani of only Kabir I would be still a Sikh?

Sikh80 · #23 (**permalink**) 10-12-2007, 11:54 PM

You are a Sikh [my presumption],sir,. Kindly go thru. the objection raised ,if it is worth the salt. One has no right be judgemental about others unless one is sure as to what one states. It is immaterail if One quotes kabir ji or not. Guru Sahibs have quoted "Prahalad' and 'Hrinkashyap' that would not be heard by christians. You seem to be a Sikh. Make your soul understand sikhi. Rest can be forgiven for ignorance. But not a sikhi worth a dime. Pl. let yourself have the privelege that U r entitled to. It is only up to u.It is not very important if I post my views or in books that sell very well evenin US.

You would be a Sikh till your conscience permits. I cannot be a judge nor can anyone else. Stop being in a fool's paradise.
I await your reply. You are very much here.
Rgards randip ji.

randip singh · #24 (**permalink**) 11-12-2007, 12:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sikh80

You are a Sikh [my presumption],sir,. Kindly go thru. the objection raised ,if it is worth the salt. One has a right no be judgemental about others unless one is sure as to what one states. It is immaterail if One quotes kabir or not. Guru Sahibs have quoted "Prahalad' and 'Hrinkashyap' that would not be heard by christians. You seem to be a Sikh. Make your soul understand sikhi. Rest can be forgiven for ignorance. But not a sikhi worth a dime. Pl. let yourself have the privelege that U r entitled to. It is only up to u.
You would be a Sikh till your conscience permits. I cannot be a judge nor can anyone else. Stop being in a fool's paradise.
I await your reply. You are very much here.
Rgards randip ji.

Look. Don't be offended by what I have asked. All I am asking is , is clarification.

You seem to be saying that if one follows the Bani of the Bhagats (or one Bani specifically), one can call oneself a Sikh. Is this what you are saying? If not please clarify?

Sikh80 · #25 (**permalink**) 11-12-2007, 12:40 AM

Sikhs are very humble beings. They have been moulded in the concept of Miri /piri. Yes if sikhs follow to the extent as the banis of saints are contained in SGGS ji one should be proud to be a Sikh.

Bani of any one which appears in SGGS is most respecable and is to be followed by a Sikh. Hope it makes sense with you and thy idiocyncracies.

randip singh · #26 (**permalink**) 11-12-2007, 05:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sikh80

Sikhs are very humble beings. They have been moulded in the concept of Miri /piri. Yes if sikhs follow to the extent as the banis of saints are contained in SGGS ji one should be proud to be a Sikh.

Bani of any one which appears in SGGS is most respecable and is to be followed by a Sikh. Hope it makes sense with you and thy idiocyncracies.

Ok so what you are saying is that if we follow the Bani to the extent that it is in Sri Guru Granth Sahib ji then it is OK?

The reason why I asked is because someone asked me this question years ago. I used to think that it is OK to follow all the teachings of Namdev and Bhagat Kabir, until (especially Bhagat Kabir) I found things he has stated at total odds with what Sikhi says........there was one of his writings not in Bani where he condems women as evil and to be avoided........I found that at odds with Sri Guru Granth Sahib ji.

I think what our Guru's have done is taken aspects of various teachings that have common ground and discarded the rest. Wold you concur?

namjap · #27 (**permalink**) 11-12-2007, 10:32 AM

There are alot of verses from Kabir and other saints which have been excluded from SGGS - the reason is because they contradict each other and point towards austerities and rituals with more self importance attached to them than towards Akaal Purukh (those verses) are excluded. There are many who follow Kabir Panth and confuse themselves to be Sikhs.

Sikh80 · #28 (**permalink**) 11-12-2007, 10:53 AM

Respected Namjap ji,
In India we have 'fire-extinguisher' services named as 'Fire-Brigade'.It is a separate entity altogether. I do respect your role as a Fire Brigade.

Regards once again.

randip singh · #29 (**permalink**) 11-12-2007, 05:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sikh80

Respected Namjap ji,
In India we have 'fire-extinguisher' services named as 'Fire-Brigade'.It is a separate entity altogether. I do respect your role as a Fire Brigade.

Regards once again.

from my above post:

Quote:

Ok so what you are saying is that if we follow the Bani to the extent that it is in Sri Guru Granth Sahib ji then it is OK?

The reason why I asked is because someone asked me this question years ago. I used to think that it is OK to follow all the teachings of Namdev and Bhagat Kabir, until (especially Bhagat Kabir) I found things he has stated at total odds with what Sikhi says........there was one of his writings not in Bani where he condems women as evil and to be avoided........I found that at odds with Sri Guru Granth Sahib ji.

I think what our Guru's have done is taken aspects of various teachings that have common ground and discarded the rest. Wold you concur?

Do you concur?

Sikh80 · #30 (**permalink**) 11-12-2007, 07:09 PM

Dear Randip jeo,
ssa,
It is for the third time that you have forced this upon me to comment upon as to why something has been done by Guru sahibaans. I am forced to comment upon as per that I think is correct. You may kindly get the answer from someone else. I refuse to entertain your kiddish request.

It is as per gurbani, that one should not indulge in excessive intellectualisation.[Japu ji sahib]

lakh sianapa nal hovey ta ek na chalay Naal,
Kiv sachiara hoiyae kiv kure tute Pal,
Hukum Rajai Chalna Nanak likhiya naal.

I am a poor creature or we are all poor creature who know
nothing of His creativity and HIS actions.How can then we comment upon HIS actions. We are no body. The one who judges all cannot be judged by HIS creation.It would simply be a foolish exercise. let us look at something that I have taken from some parallel post and put the things in the perspective.

Guru Nanak was, therefore, the EMBODIMENT of Divine Light:

'Gur Nanak Dev Govind roop.'
(Basant Mohalla 5, p-1192, Guru Granth Sahib)
'Guru Nanak is embodiment of the Light of God.' (Translation of the above

Further Guru Nanak's body was a platform from which God Himself spoke and delivered His message- Gurbani (Divine Word). God manifested Himself through Guru Nanak:

'Gur meh aap samoai sabad vartaya.'
(Var Malar ki Mohalla 1, p-1279)
'In the true Guru (Nanak) He installed His Own Spirit Through him, God speaketh Himself.' (Translation of the above)

God is in the Guru and Guru is in God. Though God is everywhere and in everybody but His traits are illuminated through the Guru. The Jot (Divine Light) that enshrined Guru Nanak's body and the Primal Jot of God are, therefore, one and the same:

'Gur Nanak Nanak har soai.'
(Gaund Mohalla 5, p-865)
'O Nanak, Jot of Nanak and God are one.' (Translation of the above)

Again the Janamsakhis (biographies) reveal that God spoke to Guru Nanak and said:

'Mei aad parmeshar aur tu gur parmeshar.'
'I am the Primal God and thou art Guru God.' (Translation of the above)

We eulogise so much and now someone ask me to look into the actions and reason out as to why something was done or why it was not. May HE be blessed with something of reality. My guru Sahib is GOD and we exist here because HE wanted us. I shall not even think of answering your question. Let someone else may do it.My conscience does not permit me to say something about my Maalik that is not HIS praise.

In the end I would close with this line that seems to me appropriate as the thread is about 'Jaap'

'Jo jo japai so hoi punit Bhagat bhai lavai man hit.'
(Gauri Sukhmani Mohalla 5, p-290)
'He shall become pure whosoever repeateth His Name With devotion, affection and heartfelt love.' (Translation of the above)

with deep regards to Randip singh jio