Ek Omkar?

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa,
Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh!

Recently, I heard of this expression “Ik Omkar”, I already know the other one “Ik Onkar”, however, what is the difference between this one and “omkar”

Someone said it was the true word, I don’t know.

Can anyone explain?

Thanks

-Bindy Bains
(Formerly Khalsa Starr)

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The Lionchild BLog
Religion, philosophy, and a little of me

Here however is another thought in the same Vaar that might make sense of things.

ਅੰਬਾਂ ਸਧਰ ਨ ਉਤਰੈ ਆਣਿ ਅੰਬਾਕੜੀਆਂ ਜੇ ਖਾਏ ।
anbaan sadhar n utarai aani anbaakarheeaan jay khaaay|

By eating mango blossoms the desire for eating mangoes is not fulfilled.

Bhai Gurdas, Vaar 39, Pauree 20, line 3

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gux gwvw idnu rwiq nwnk cwau eyhu || gun gaavaa dhin raath naanak chaao eaehu ||To sing Your Glorious Praises day and night - O Nanak, this is my heart-felt desire.

Pray Truth for all and say Satsriakaal!
Dear all and Aad0002 Jee!

International Akaali Jee referred two lines from Bhai Gurdas Jee written in the Gurmukhi script. These are
eykMkwru iekWg iliK AUVw EaMkwru ilKwieaw [
siqnwmu krqw purKu inrBAu hoie inrvYru sdwieaw [ Vaar 39

Then he wrote "Here bhai sahib is pronouncing Ik Ooaankar."

He may be a teacher and guide for many youngsters on the forum at discoversikhi dot net. Readers do not accept from him reading something different that written.

The true Gurus have never given any instruction to read <> Ikonkaar. Nobody knows when and why Sikhs have started doing so. I feel the true Gurus have written so much. They could guide giving an instruction to write <> but reading it Ikonkaar.

I want to ask. Is there a problem in reading <> as they have written it? Sikh missionaries are otherwise very strict in pronouncing Sri Guru Granth Sahib Jee correctly though.


Balbir Singh

Pray Truth for all and say Satsriakaal!
Dear all!

<> As written By Gurdev in Sri Guru Granth Sahib Jee is the ocean of treasures. Writing it in one way or other to pronounce may limit its infinite Wisdom.

Many dumb dummy persons try to read scriptures and writings from authors to present their mixture. Their show but leads no one to the true Naam satisfying the spiritual thirst.

The beginning part of Sri Guru Granth Sahib Jee is not explaining God, in my experience. Please ponder. Is it possible to express God through written words of a language whose true Nature is inexpressible Truth?


Balbir Singh

Balbir ji

My hunch is that International Akaali ji was not referring to the two particular lines you have quoted. He may have been referring to the vaar as a whole -- with the invocation at the beginning giving the Gurmukhi spelling.

I have my own opinions about arguments about pronunciation based on the English phonetic transliteration. It is kind of futile -- because these transliterations are not based on Gurmukhi phonetic rules but English phonetic rules that are being used to create the transliteration. But for now I don't plan to get into that issue.

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gux gwvw idnu rwiq nwnk cwau eyhu || gun gaavaa dhin raath naanak chaao eaehu ||To sing Your Glorious Praises day and night - O Nanak, this is my heart-felt desire.

Also,

The true Gurus have never given any instruction to read <> Ikonkaar. Nobody knows when and why Sikhs have started doing so. They probably started when the shabads were first written as manuscripts. And they probably recited the shabads more than they read them initially. Manuscripts were not numerous. The Adi Granth was not compiled until the 4th Guru. I feel the true Gurus have written so much. They could guide giving an instruction to write <>but reading it Ikonkaar.

I am not sure why this is a concern for you. Once the shabads were grouped together in the Adi Granth, reading all the shabads would be a natural thing to do. If your shabads are all together in one book, then reading it would be a normal human reaction. If you mean reading <> as Ikonkaar, instead of some other pronunciation -- why would they give instructions? This may sound somewhat naive -- but don't you think they all knew how to pronounce it? So there would not be any reason to go back over old ground.

Sikh missionaries are otherwise very strict in pronouncing Sri Guru Granth Sahib Jee correctly though. Not only Sikh missionaries. Mispronunciation can make one word sound like another word-- leading to incorrect understanding. The Dandami were created to teach the Shabad -- including correct pronunication.

Balbir Singh[/quote]

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gux gwvw idnu rwiq nwnk cwau eyhu || gun gaavaa dhin raath naanak chaao eaehu ||To sing Your Glorious Praises day and night - O Nanak, this is my heart-felt desire.

Dear Balbir Singh ji

Satsriakal!

first part which is also popularly known as Mool Mantar - are you refering this

May be it says about the attributes of God if not god itself .
In my understanding we can talk about god using the attributes

please share what is your experience regarding this

Jatinder SIngh

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PrIdw kwl^ØI ijnI n rwivAw DaulI rwvY koie ]

Pray Truth for all and say Satsriakaal!
Dear all and Aad0002 Jee!

Thanks for your sensible posts.

Quote "They probably started when the shabads were first written as manuscripts. And they probably recited the shabads more than they read them initially. Manuscripts were not numerous. The Adi Granth was not compiled until the 4th Guru."
Is this the reason to recite reverend Guru's written word differently? Perhaps it is the high time to realize wrong traditions following with closed eyes.
Did Gurdev write whole Granth to read and understand as it is but one word to read, recite and understand it in according to one's individual choice?

Quote " If you mean reading <> as Ikonkaar, instead of some other pronunciation -- why would they give instructions?"
This is exactly what I am saying. They have not given any instructions. Still, preachers are laying so much stress to read their writings exactly but at one instance.
Why should someone add his words to pronounce <>?

Quote "but don't you think they all knew how to pronounce it?"
Reverend Gurdev knew why they wrote <>. They also knew how to pronounce it.
Preachers and their Sikhs have changed it. This clearly shows that they have lost its wisdom.

Quote "So there would not be any reason to go back over old ground."
Those who wanted something new have changed Sikhi completely. Please watch it. All what a Sikh is doing today has nothing to do with the true Guru's suggestion.

Quote "Mispronunciation can make one word sound like another word-- leading to incorrect understanding."
One receives God's wisdom through True Naam Simran, not by reciting the written instructions from Gurdev. Reading and understanding the correct instructions also do not help alone.

Quote "The Dandami were created to teach the Shabad -- including correct pronunication."
The true Guru's exclusive suggestion is receiving true Naam and living in God's Will. They never instructed to teach or learn their writings and its correct pronunciation. Please provide one Vaak from Gurdev for reference if someone has found so. I will be grateful.

**************

Quote from dear Jatinder Jee "May be it says about the attributes of God if not god itself .
In my understanding we can talk about god using the attributes."

Occasionally the reverend Gurus sing that one cannot say a word about HIM and HIS Attributes.
khxu n jweI qyrI iqlu vifAweI ]
"kahan na jaaee teree tilu vadiaaee." SGGS 9-12

Gurdev did not mention one word that the beginning of Sri Guru Granth Sahib Jee is about the Supreme Lord.
My curiosity is to know how and why preachers and translators have come to this conclusion.


Balbir Singh

Balbir ji

Glad we agree on some things. Don't know how much value to attribute to anything posted by me. Just impressions. And have to admit that I more than a little confused right now.

Here are 2 vaaks from Vaar 39.

ੴ ਸਤਿਗੁਰ ਪ੍ਰਸਾਦਿ ॥
ikonkaar satigur prasaadi ॥
One Oankar, the primal energy, realized through the grace of divine preceptor
Line 1

ਏਕੰਕਾਰੁ ਇਕਾਂਗ ਲਿਖਿ ਊੜਾ ਓਅੰਕਾਰੁ ਲਿਖਾਇਆ ।
aykankaaru ikaang|ikhi oorhaa aoankaaru|ikhaaiaa|
That homogenous supreme reality (God) ) first was written as numeral one mulmantr – the credal formula) and then He was inscribed as Ura syllable of Gurmukhi, further pronounced as Oankar.
Line 2

New Year Balbir ji.

__________________
gux gwvw idnu rwiq nwnk cwau eyhu || gun gaavaa dhin raath naanak chaao eaehu ||To sing Your Glorious Praises day and night - O Nanak, this is my heart-felt desire.

Pray Truth for all and say Satsriakaal!
Dear all and Aad0002 Jee!

Strange, Guru Arjan Dev Jee ignored the wishes of writing Oankaar after Ura. Sri Guru Gobind Singh Jee also overlooked the writings of Bhai Gurdas Jee and did not write Oankaar after the numeral one and Ura.

Interesting, the tradition of Bhai Gurdas Jee is animated today in mind and rituals of Sikhs through dedicated preachers.
Who is taking care of the true Guru's values?

ਏਕੰਕਾਰੁ ਇਕਾਂਗ ਲਿਖਿ ਊੜਾ ਓਅੰਕਾਰੁ ਲਿਖਾਇਆ ।
aykankaaru ikaang|ikhi oorhaa aoankaaru|ikhaaiaa|

Quote "That homogenous supreme reality (God) ) first was written as numeral one mulmantr – the credal formula) and then He was inscribed as Ura syllable of Gurmukhi, further pronounced as Oankar."
May I ask why Preachers are not reciting 'Ik Ura Oankaar' as written by Bhai Gurdas Jee?

According to your words mulmantra begins with numeral one and then the Ura syllable further written and pronounced Oankaar because Bhai Gurdas Jee has written it.
Bhai Gurdas Jee writes in his Vaar 6-19-2 that mulmantra is 'sati naamu kartaa purakhu' Vaar 6-19-2.
Guru Naanak dev Jee, the revered Guru of Sikhs, says that 'mulmantra is Hari Naam Rasaayan' SGGS Ang 1040-19.
Please explain. Whom should Sikhs listen truly?

Quote " New Year Balbir ji."
New Christian Year to Aad0002 Jee too.


Balbir Singh

Respected Balbir ji

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gux gwvw idnu rwiq nwnk cwau eyhu || gun gaavaa dhin raath naanak chaao eaehu ||To sing Your Glorious Praises day and night - O Nanak, this is my heart-felt desire.