Sikhs With Kirpan Not Allowed in Quebec Legislature

a.mother · #10 (**permalink**) 21-Jan-2011, 02:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spnadmin

The same thing is happening here. Wherever there are large number of immigrant minorities. And it gets worse when economic conditions are poor.

spnadmin ji you are right. Politician always wants to drive people away from real problems,and thats what they are doing it. Whenever any state or country need work force they invite people from abroad and then some time they are asking for rights then they CALLED IMMIGRANTS or OROUTSIDERS.

spnadmin · #11 (**permalink**) 21-Jan-2011, 02:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by a.mother

spnadmin ji you are right. Politician always wants to drive people away from real problems,and thats what they are doing it. Whenever any state or country need work force they invite people from abroad and then some time they are asking for rights then they CALLED IMMIGRANTS or OROUTSIDERS.

Yes, a.mother ji

Immigrants/outsiders were invited and sponsored in the first place to build our national economies, when there was no native workforce to do the work, or no one wanted to do it. The children of Sikh immigrants went on to excel in the professions and business. New waves of Sikh immigrants once again fill in the gaps in the local workforce.

This has been the case with Sikhs in Canada, and the northwest US. Sikhs worked dangerous jobs in the lumber industry, as lumberjacks and in mills. Sikhs built railroads under deplorable conditions. Sikhs worked in mines. Sikhs served as day laborers in the farms, orchards and vineyards of the Pacific coast and valleys. Now in the Fresno area, Sikhs are major players among landowning farmers. I can remember in the past 5 years Punjabi Sikh farmers were courted by Canada to sell farms in Punjab and develop farmland in the Central/north provinces for Canada's agricultural development. If you are looking for contributors, not takers, bet on Sikhs. Sikhs have been part of the development of the economies of Canada and the US for more than a century -- and now what?

Mai Harinder Kaur · #12 (**permalink**) 21-Jan-2011, 02:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by a.mother

spnadmin ji you are right. Politician always wants to drive people away from real problems,and thats what they are doing it. Whenever any state or country need work force they invite people from abroad and then some time they are asking for rights then they CALLED IMMIGRANTS or OROUTSIDERS.

And then "They" get blamed for all our problems.

Scapegoating is a very old and ugly practice. You can always find someone - usually some obvious minority - to blame for anything. It's much easier than defining and solving the problem in a logical manner. Blame the Muslims, blame the Jews, blame the Mexicans or the gays or us. Just blame some group, get after them, get rid of them and all our problems will be solved!

Whether it's kirpans or niqabs in Quebec or Mexicans in the USA, Jews in Germany or the Roma everywhere, it's all the same thing. Us (the good guys) and them (the bad guys). I find being a Sikh right now is confusing. As a Quebecker, I seem to be both Us (the good guys) and Them (the bad guys).

When are we going to grow up?

a.mother · #13 (**permalink**) 21-Jan-2011, 03:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spnadmin

Yes, a.mother ji

Immigrants/outsiders were invited and sponsored in the first place to build our national economies, when there was no native workforce to do the work, or no one wanted to do it. The children of Sikh immigrants went on to excel in the professions and business. New waves of Sikh immigrants once again fill in the gaps in the local workforce.

This has been the case with Sikhs in Canada, and the northwest US. Sikhs worked dangerous jobs in the lumber industry, as lumberjacks and in mills. Sikhs built railroads under deplorable conditions. Sikhs worked in mines. Sikhs served as day laborers in the farms, orchards and vineyards of the Pacific coast and valleys. Now in the Fresno area, Sikhs are major players among landowning farmers. I can remember in the past 5 years Punjabi Sikh farmers were courted by Canada to sell farms in Punjab and develop farmland in the Central/north provinces for Canada's agricultural development. If you are looking for contributors, not takers, bet on Sikhs. Sikhs have been part of the development of the economies of Canada and the US for more than a century -- and now what?

spnadminji you have cover all those parts of our lives thats showes how hard we works.
I am looking at other side on ctv montreal news on same topic . I don't understand why people think we are the second class citizens .Those are who is talking loud they concider them self like NATIVE .

Soul_jyot · #14 (**permalink**) 21-Jan-2011, 05:20 AM

Kirpan demands 'respect,' Ignatieff tells Quebec

Montreal— The Canadian Press
Published Thursday, Jan. 20, 2011 4:18PM EST
Last updated Thursday, Jan. 20, 2011 5:35PM EST

The Liberal Party has defended the right of devout Sikhs to wear religious ceremonial daggers in legislatures, chiding a Bloc Québécois proposal to ban their presence in Parliament.

The announcement by Liberal Leader Michael Ignatieff on Thursday, which echoes the position of the NDP, makes it clear that any attempt to ban the kirpan would face resistance in Parliament.

That puts Mr. Ignatieff at odds with the Quebec National Assembly, which earlier this week barred entry to a group of Sikhs who were wearing their kirpans.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/canada/34182-sikhs-kirpan-not-allowed-quebec-legislature.html

It now appears clear that the Bloc would never receive the all-party consensus it needs to have the Board of Internal Economy declare the kirpan a security threat.

"The kirpan is not a weapon," Mr. Ignatieff told reporters in Montreal. "It's a religious symbol and we have to respect it."

Those comments leave the Conservative government as the only remaining national party that has yet to take a position on the issue.

Requests for comment from Immigration Minister Jason Kenney, who is responsible for multiculturalism, were met with a response that he was travelling on Wednesday and again on Thursday. The Prime Minister's Office also declined to comment.

On Thursday a Kenney spokesman sent the following emailed response: "Our Government does not believe parliamentary security should be directed by partisan politics. Specific questions on the security of the House of Commons should be directed to the Sergeant-at-Arms."

The issue surfaces on the same week that the Tories have made a visible display of wooing the Sikh vote in suburban Toronto.

A party candidate in Brampton-Springdale issued a news release this celebrating defections from the riding association of his rival, Liberal MP Ruby Dhalla, and declaring that the Conservative Party cared about delivering results for new Canadians.

At the same time the Tories are hoping to gain ground in Quebec – where the kirpan ban has ignited no major opposition and, based on initial reaction, may be quite popular.

If the kirpan issue causes political dilemmas for some, the Liberals and NDP have taken an unequivocal line. New Democrats have already called the Bloc move shameful.

When asked about the issue Thursday, Mr. Ignatieff replied that it should be treated as a question of religious freedom rather than simply a security matter.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=34182

"All Canadians have the right to have access to democratic spaces and legislatures," he said in French. "I was sorry to hear about the Bloc's proposals on the issue."

Mr. Ignatieff was in Montreal as part of a cross-country tour of ridings the Liberals will target in the next election. Among those ridings is Jeanne-Le Ber, which Liberals narrowly lost to the Bloc in 2008.

source: http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/politics/kirpan-demands-respect-ignatieff-tells-quebec/article1877737/

spnadmin · #15 (**permalink**) 21-Jan-2011, 05:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by a.mother

spnadminji you have cover all those parts of our lives thats showes how hard we works.
I am looking at other side on ctv montreal news on same topic . I don't understand why people think we are the second class citizens .Those are who is talking loud they concider them self like NATIVE .

a.mother ji

Again very troubling. Canada and the US are nations of immigrants. The only natives are the original Americans, the tribal peoples. And they were treated even worse. Humans can be a sorry lot.

I have a friend who has written books on this very subject - the settlement of the American West specifically. He starts on the east coast in the 17th Century, and explains the history of progressive development of North America in each generation. Wave after wave of immigrants arrived, and then considered the immigrants to follow as lesser beings, intruders. Earlier immigrants thought of themselves as the true Americans. It is always an uphill battle for immigrants, and for the sake of our own souls important to remember the lessons learned when our time comes to greet the next group to arrive.

spnadmin · #16 (**permalink**) 21-Jan-2011, 06:17 AM

There has been a significant level of criticism in the print and electronic media of the Quebec government, officials, and of provincialism in this story.

an example from letters to the editor in The Gazette, today, in reference to this remark by Louise Beaudoin,
“Multiculturalism may be a Canadian value but it’s not a Quebec one,” said Louise Beaudoin, PQ critic for secularism. “We haven’t signed the Constitution of Canada because it contains this notion of multiculturalism.”

Small Minds

I found Louise Beaudoin's reaction to the translation of the Sikh letter shameful. Having worked with many Sikhs over the years, I found that the majority spoke a minimum of four languages. To nitpick over a translation error only shows the small minds that seem to be prevalent in the Parti Quebecois

When Beaudoin can write a letter in a language other than French without making an error, then maybe she can complain. This was nothing other than a diversion to make people forget that for all its rhetoric, the PQ is not inclusive.

Brian Caldwell Montreal

Read more: http://www.montrealgazette.com/life/...#ixzz1BcbyJpNd

Who is Louise Beaudoin? Small excerpt from www.Vigile.com or The Vigil

Sovereignty strategist Louise Beaudoin on ‘Frenchification,’ Quebec’s self-confidence, and how to separate from Canada bit by bit

Louise Beaudoin has been at the forefront of Quebec’s sovereignty movement for over 40 years. As a cabinet minister in three Parti Québécois governments, she was largely responsible for the province’s language laws. Now, as a Montreal-area MNA, she is one of the main architects of the party’s new ‘plan for a sovereign Quebec’, which would use ‘sectoral referenda’ in order to wrestle powers like taxation and culture away from Ottawa.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=34182

Read more at this link: http://www.vigile.net/Sovereignty-strategist-Louise

So the matter of Sikhs and kirpan may have also been hijacked to serve the political agenda of French separatists and the Quebec Independence movement, with no regard for Sikhs or kirpan. Sikhs and kirpan it would appear were a convenient political football to put the political opposition in Quebec in a corner with the voters.

Mai Harinder Kaur · #17 (**permalink**) 21-Jan-2011, 07:47 AM

This is from the CBC. We need everyone to go vote ASAAP.
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=34182

Question of the Day

Vote Now! Is the kirpan a religious symbol?

The kirpan -- the ceremonial dagger worn by many Sikhs -- is not considered a weapon by law. Many Sikhs wear it in public places.

Bloc MP Claude DeBellefeuille is proposing a ban on kirpans in the House of Commons. This came after four Sikhs wearing kirpans were denied entry into the Quebec National Assembly.

You can participate in the CBC Poll at this link GO TO: http://www.cbc.ca/politics/insidepol...e-day-273.html
Reference:: Sikh Philosophy Network http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/showthread.php?t=34182