Originally Posted by Balbir Singh
Satsriakal to all and Ameri Kaur Ji!
Your efforts are to be appreciated.
But my thirst is still there to know. Where our Gurus have said in Gurbani "Janam Kundli is forbidden in Sikhi?"
Guru's Vaak on page 904 from Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji that you referred, also does not say that Janam Kundli is forbidden.
Here Gurudev is suggesting a Pandit not to waste life in calculating and predicting alone but to go for NAM. As with NAM one comes to know the 'Tat'.
Gurudev has never asked a jyotish or anyone else to give up his occupation.
You also referred "There is but One Almighty God who is the Supreme Truth."
You stressed further that our Gurus spoke many times about how a belief in God must be a belief ONLY in God. To "supplement" a belief in something other than the One Almighty was something that Nanak referred to as "duality."
We all know that the world is existing. The present world consists of you, I and others. It goes on existing even when we believe it or not.
The duality does not disappear when we pretend to have faith only in God.
Duality also does not disappear by rejecting faith in something other than The Almighty.
Duality vanishes by true Simran of true NAM.
You have also referred Rehat Maryada.
I would prefer to understand Rehat Maryada when I accept it as my Guru.
I thank you for assisting me. Please guide me further.
Balbir singh ji ,
I am giving this info from the given link about gurbani's vichar on astrology.I thought it can be very useful in this discussion. http://www.gurbani.org/webart100.htm JOTISH
Do not tell lies, O Pandit; speak the Truth. When egoism is
eradicated through the Shabad, then one finds His Home,
Reality. Calculating and counting, the astrologer draws the
horoscope. He studies it and announces it, but he does not
understand Reality. Understand, that the Gur-Shabad is above
all. Do not speak of anything else; it is all just ashes (Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji 904).
Non-apprehension of Reality creates in us misapprehension that we are miserable, limited, helpless, tearful, desperate, weak-minded, fearful and sorrowful individuals. Our non-apprehension of Reality and the consequent misapprehensions are together called Maya — illusion, ignorance, delusion, false ego, conditioned consciousness, wrong identity, etc.). The scriptures conclude that, deluded by doubts and superstitions, most of us (over 99.9 percent) deal throughout our life with this Maya only!
- iqhI guxI sMswru BRim suqw suiqAw rYix ivhwxI: The world is asleep in the three-qualitied Maya and doubt (Bharam); it passes the night of its life sleeping (Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji 920).
- jn nwnk kotn mY koaU Bjnu rwm ko pwvY: O servant Nanak, amongst millions there is hardly any mortal, who attains God's meditation (Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji 219).
There are many systems of forecasting like astrology, numerology, tarot cards, drawing and reading of horoscope, reading of face, palmistry, palm-leaf manuscripts, and so on. The Gurbani rejects such practice. It's nothing but acting in false ego or Maya; for all calculations are in the three modes of material nature — Taamas
. Those who practice these systems pullulate nowadays both in India and in the West in a futile hope of satisfying their unending lust, greed and selfishness. Since Maya is false, all such practices are false as well. We are urged by the Gurbani not to approve or believe in such Mayaic indulgence.
- pMifq pVdy joqkI nw bUJih bIcwrw: The Pandits and the astrologers study their books, but they do not understand inner inquiry (Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji 970).
- gix gix joqku kWfI kInI]pVY suxwvY qqu n cInI: Calculating and counting, the astrologer draws the hroscope. He studies it and announces it, but he does not understand Reality (Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji 904).
- haumY sBw gxq hY gxqY nau suKu nwih: All accounting is in egotism. In this accounting, there is no Peace (Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji 36).
- saux sgun bIcwrxy nauN gRh bwrh rwis vIcwrw]kwmx tUxy AausIAW kx sohI pwswr pwswrw: Saoun sagan beechaarane naou grah baarah raasi veechaaraa. kkaaman toone aouseeaaan kan sohee paasaar paasaaraa: The life led in the light of omens, the nine planets, the twelve signs of the zodiac; Incantations, magic divination by lines and by the voice is all futile (Bhai Gurdaas, Vaar: 5 Pauree:9).
actions performed in material consciousness create Vaasnaas
: the undigested desires, psychological conditionings, latent memories, innate tendencies, inherent inclinations, self-limitations, dispositions, obstinate clinging to a fancy or deluded imagination, memories or subtle impressions of the past existing in our bosom. In turn — since Vaasnaas
produce thoughts and thoughts produce actions — these Vaasnaas seek their exhaustion through further causative or fruitive actions. For which, man moves from one field of activities to another within the span of his life; creating unending barrage of more Vaasnaas
in the process.
The system of Jotish
is based on the premise that man's these tendencies are recorded under the astrological signs in which he is born. In other words, as indicated by the Jotish
, the man takes birth through an astrological conglomeration of signs, also called astrological chart. By reading the astrological charts, Jotishees
(astrologists) pretend to predict the future events of one's present incarnation. Card readers, palm readers, face readers, etc., pretend to do the same.
The truth of the matter is that the planets or the lines in one's palm or face do not cause the events in an individual's life to which he reacts either positively or negatively. It is our false ego or unenlightened existence that causes us to react, and does not let us stick to the Truth. Thus, all actions result from our mental drawbacks — desires and fears.
The infallible Law of Karma
) holds everyone responsible for what he is or going to be. We harvest exactly what we sow. If there is a cause, there is an effect. If there is a Karma or activity (cause), there is a reaction or result (effect). This is the Kaarmic principle that brings back the results of one's actions to him, to be worked out later. There is no escape from this Divine Law.
- jyhw bIjY so luxY mQY jo iliKAwsu: As the man plants so does he reap; his destiny is recorded on his forehead (Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji 134).
- jyvyhy krm kmwvdw qyvyhy Plqy: One obtains fruits according to the deeds which he does (Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji 317).
However, a thief, a crook, a liar, a criminal, a materialist (Manmukh
), a Maya-ridden (Mayadhaaree
) or an ego-man always thinks that he can circumvent the system! Likewise, those who practice or believe in Jotish
, etc., also think that they can not only predict the good and bad events in one's future, but, by maneuvering the planetary influence through some paid prescribed actions or rituals, they can also remedy the negative situations or their effects!
- piV piV pMifq joqkI Qky ByKI Brim Bulwey: The Pandits, the religious scholars, and the astrologers read and read until they grow weary, while the fanatics are deluded by doubt (Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji 68).
- pMifq vwcih poQIAw nw bUJih vIcwru]An kau mqI dy clih mwieAw kw vwpwru]kQnI JUTI jgu BvY rhxI sbdu su swru]kyqy pMifq joqkI bydw krih bIcwru]vwid ivroiD slwhxy vwdy Awvxu jwxu]ibnu gur krm n CutsI kih suix AwiK vKwxu: The Pandits read their books, but they do not understand the real meaning. They give instructions to others, and then walk away, but they deal in Maya themselves. Speaking falsehood, they wander around the world, while those who remain true to the Shabad are excellent and exalted. There are so many Pandits and astrologers who ponder over the Vedas. They glorify their disputes and arguments, and in these controversies they continue coming and going. Without the Guru, they are not released from their karma, although they speak and listen and preach and explain (Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji 56).
Before the final marriage vows are spoken, or before taking a journey, or before starting a new business, and so on, many pay dearly to Jotishees
to judge astrological compatibility of their undertaking. This is one example of how a conditioned, corrupt, materialist or a doubt-ridden mind functions. Under the influence of body-bound inclinations arising from emotional attachment to vanishing worldly objects, one loses his reasoning and discriminating intellect (Viveka Budhi
), and end up not knowing Real from unreal.
- lY BwiV kry vIAwhu]kiF kwglu dsy rwhu]suix vyKhu lokw eyhu ivfwxu]min AMDw nwau sujwxu: He (Jotashee) takes payment for performing marriages; reading their horoscopes, he shows them the way. Hear, and see, O people, this wondrous thing. He is mentally blind, and yet his name is wisdom! (Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji 471).
- pMifq joqkI siB piV piV kUkdy iksu pih krih pukwrw rwm]mwieAw mohu AMqir mlu lwgY mwieAw ky vwpwrw rwm]mwieAw ky vwpwrw jgiq ipAwrw Awvix jwix duKu pweI]ibKu kw kIVw ibKu isau lwgw ibs†w mwih smweI]jo Duir iliKAw soie kmwvY koie n mytxhwrw]nwnk nwim rqy iqn sdw suKu pwieAw hoir mUrK kUik muey gwvwrw: All the religious scholars and astrologers read and study, and argue and shout. Who are they trying to teach? Deep within, they are stained with the filth of emotional attachment to Maya; they deal in Maya alone. They love to deal in Maya in this world; coming and going, they suffer in pain. The worm of poison is addicted to poison; it is immersed in manure. He does what is pre-ordained for him; no one can erase his destiny. O Nanak, attuned to the Naam, lasting peace is found; the ignorant fools die screaming (Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji 570-571).
Who is likely to worry about good and bad omens? By thinking and worrying about auspicious (Shubh
) and inauspicious(Apsagun
) omens, one falls victim to fear and anxiety. According to the scriptures, those who worry about Shubh
are devoid of the Divine Name. As the Gurbani says: they do not have the understanding of the sublime essence of the Divine ( Shabad, Naam
or Word). Only an Illumined Being is above and beyond the influence of Shubh
), thus immune from their adverse effects, temptation or spell.
- sgun Apsgun iqs kau lgih ijsu cIiq n AwvY: Good omens and bad omens affect those who do not keep the Lord in the mind (Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji 401).
- eyko nwmu iDAwie qUM suKu pwvih myry BweI]haumY dUjw dUir kir vfI vifAweI]1]rhwau]iesu BgqI no suir nr muin jn locdy ivxu siqgur pweI n jwie]pMifq pVdy joiqkI iqn bUJ n pwie: Meditate on the One Naam, and you will find real Peace, O my Siblings of Destiny. Eradicate egoism and duality, and your glory will be glorious. ||1|| Pause || The angels, humans and silent sages long for this devotional worship, but without the True Guru, it cannot be attained. The Pandits and the astrologers read their books, but they do not understand (Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji 425).
or any reactionary Karma
can never release man's personality from its misapprehensions. It's the unbroken contemplation on the Divine Essence that can set one free from the dualistic principle of Maya such as Shubh
. So long the ego-mind entertains its fancies (mental "filth"), one subjects himself to be cheated by Jotishees
, bogus Sants
, mentally blind religious scholars, deluded priests or Bhaais
, and so on.
- piV piV pMifq joqkI vwd krih bIcwru]miq buiD BvI n buJeI AMqir loB ivkwru]lK caurwsIh Brmdy BRim BRim hoie KuAwru]pUrib iliKAw kmwvxw koie n mytxhwru:After all their reading, the Pandits, the religious scholars, and the astrologers argue and debate. Their intellect and understanding are perverted; they just don’t understand. They are filled with greed and corruption. Through 8.4 million incarnations they wander lost and confused; through all their wandering and roaming, they are ruined. They act according to their pre-ordained destiny, which no one can erase (Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji 27).
Baabaa Nanak spent all his life trying to set us free from doubts, Karamkaands
(worldly entanglements), unmeaning rituals and superstitions. He taught us to live by the Hukam
(Divine Law), and, thereby, take the life as it presents itself to us. He urged us to live a Divine Life as a Spiritual Being. A spiritual Being is always fearless. Because the Self, our Spiritual Nature, is not a bundle of fear and temptations; it's instead a Blissful-Conscious-Existance. Only upon Realizing this Truth, the moss of doubt (Bharam
) will leave us alone.
- jn nwnk ibnu Awpw cInY imtY n BRm kI kweI: O servant Nanak, without knowing one’s own Self, the moss of doubt is not removed (Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji 684).
- gxqY pRBU n pweIAY dUjY BrmIqw: God cannot be obtained by counting; the mortal wanders in doubt (Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji 510).
Among the millions of species of living beings (animals, birds, insects and worms), the human being alone is privileged to have the choice of action. No other sentient has this rare capacity and freedom to act. Along with the choice of action, the human being has been also endowed with the power to think and then act. However, in bondage, ignorance and greed we misuse or abuse this capacity and freedom and then blame some outside agency such as God, fate or destiny for Shubh
omens. Thus, it's not the fault of Spiritual Masters or the scriptures if we keep falling back into the same "filth" of doubt, again and again.
Our deluded mind is the culprit. If we want to end our misapprehensions once and forever, then the Gurbani's advice is to continuously read the "horoscope" of the mind. This may lead us to a question: since mind is nothing but thoughts-stuff, how can one go about reading its horoscope? What is that tool which can help us read the mind's horoscope? The Gurbani has given us a very simple tool for this purpose! Every moment, there is a Spiritual and psychological battle going on between the Soul and the blind sense-infatuated mind under the delusive influence of the false ego. We can invoke this God given power of introspection to review the battle of the day in our mind in order to determine who won the battle - the good or the evil. As scriptures tell us, "good" being that which expresses truth and virtue and attracts the consciousness to God; and "evil" being ignorance and delusion, repels the consciousness from God. Thus, we, the material beings, can realize the All-auspicious within, here and now, only if we side with "goodness" and win the battle between the good and evil inclinations that guide our activities on the external bodily field of action. Maintaining continuos contemplation and association of the Sat (Truth) within and without are sure aids to transcend the fancies of Shubh
- ddY dosu n dyaU iksY dosu krMmw AwpixAw: Dadda: Do not blame anyone else; blame instead your own actions (Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji 433).
- jyhI suriq qyhw iqn rwhu: As is your awareness, so is your way (Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji 25).
- jYsw syvY qYso hoie: As you think, so you become (Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji 224).
- jyhI mnsw kir lwgY qyhw Plu pwey: As is the mentality, so is the meed (Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji 116).
- jb Awpn Awpu Awip auir DwrY]qau sgn Apsgn khw bIcwrY: Jabb aapan aapu aapi uri dhaarai. Tayu sagan apsagan kahaa beechaarai: When He kept Himself, All-in-all, unto His Own Heart, then who considered omens to be good or bad? (Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji 291).
- bMdy Koju idl hr roj nw iPru pryswnI mwih: O human being, search your own heart every day, and do not wander around in confusion (Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji 727).
- mn kI pqRI vwcxI suKI hU suKu swru]so bRwhmxu Blw AwKIAY ij bUJY bRhmu bIcwru]hir swlwhy hir pVY gur kY sbid vIcwir]AwieAw Ehu prvwxu hY ij kul kw kry auDwru]AgY jwiq n puCIAY krxI sbdu hY swru]horu kUVu pVxw kUVu kmwvxw ibiKAw nwil ipAwru]AMdir suKu n hoveI mnmuK jnmu KuAwru]nwnk nwim rqy sy aubry gur kY hyiq Apwir: To read the horoscope of the mind, is the most Sublime Joyful Peace. He alone is called a good Brahmin, who understands God in contemplative meditation. He praises the Lord, and reads of the Lord, and contemplates the Gur-Shabad. Celebrated and approved is the coming into the world of such a person, who saves all his generations as well. Hereafter, no one is questioned about social status; excellent and sublime is the practice of the Shabad. Other study is false, and other actions are false; such people are in love with poison. They do not find any peace within themselves; the Manmukhs (material beings) waste away their lives. O Nanak, those who are attuned to the Naam are saved; they have infinite love for the Guru (Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji 1093).
As indicated in the Gurbani, only that time is Shubh
which passes in remembrance of the Divine; only that place is Shubh
where the Divine is remembered; and only that breadth is Shubh
which is utilized to meditate on the Divine Essence. All else is just corruption — the unenlightened existence.
- Awgm inrgm joiqk jwnih bhu bhu ibAwkrnw]qMq mMqR sB AauKD jwnih AMiq qaU mrnw]2]rwj Bog Aru CqR isMGwsn bhu suMdir rmnw]pwn kpUr subwsk cMdn AMiq qaU mrnw]byd purwn isMimRiq sB Kojy khU n aUbrnw]khu kbIr ieau rwmih jMpau myit jnm mrnw: Those who know the Shaastras and the Vedas, astrology and the rules of grammar of many languages; those who know Tantras and mantras and all medicines — even they will die in the end. Those who enjoy regal power and rule, royal canopies and thrones, many beautiful women, betel nuts, camphor and fragrant sandalwood oil — in the end, they too will die. I have searched all the Vedas, Puraanas and Simritees, but none of these can save anyone. Says Kabeer, meditate on the Lord, and eliminate birth and death (Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji 476-477).
- sws sws sws hY jyqy mY gurmiq nwmu sm@wry]swsu swsu jwie nwmY ibnu so ibrQw swsu ibkwry: According to Gurmati (instructions of the Shabad), with as many breaths as I have, I chant the Naam. Each and every breath which escapes me without the Naam — that breath is useless and corrupt (Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji 980).
- sBsY aUupir gur sbdu bIcwru]hor kQnI bdau n sglI Cwru: Understand, that the Gur-Shabad is above all. Do not speak of anything else; it is all just ashes (Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji 904).
If we want to release our personality from its misapprehensions, the Gurbani urges us to become Gurmukhs
(Spiritual Beings). All calculations are for the Manmukhs
(material beings) for his world is in the realm of calculations (egoism or Maya). There is no accounting or calculations for the Gurmukh
; because he is relieved of all egoistic or mental calculations through the Shabad-Surti
, or God-consciousness.
- gurmuiK sglI gxq imtwvY : The Gurmukh erases all calculations (Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji 942).
- haumY gxq gur sbid invwry: Egotistic or mental calculations are relieved through the Shabad (Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji 1065).
- qUM gxqY iknY n pwieE scy AlK Apwrw: No one has attained You by clever calculations, O True, Unseen and Infinite Being (Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji 140).